We clicked immediately—and her contract with Showtime was over, so she felt free to speak her mind about Anne, feminism, the distortions of history, and the making of “The Tudors.”
Lisa! Mary Shelton is in my ancestral line. She was the mother of Alison de Heveningham who married Sir Michael de Hardy and was mother of sir John hardy. John’s son Richard came to the states in the late 16th early 17th century.
Whaaaat?!? So I can never quite identify which son is our ancestor in US. I have to look at my tree again, but all roads lead to her. I’ve spoken with a few other folks doing research, but the last time was abt 3 years past so the thread hangs.
I’ve heard lore about her caring for both Elizabeth and Mary, who went on a hunger strike after Isabella forbade her to walk behind Elizabeth to meals as HVIII demanded. Tho she may have been traumatized af with disordered eating. Also how both girls grew up to still have warm regard for her. Badass. I imagine the tension she must have experienced with two teenage girls and literal fkn Bluebeard issuing edicts.
It's true that The Tudors went downhill as a series after Anne's execution. Curious to know your take on Hilary Mantel's portrayal of Anne from Cromwell's POV.
You’ve touched on a tender spot. She and I were good “pen-pal” friends (she even gave me an exclusive interview before the second volume of Wolf Hall came out) until I published my book. In it (and in some articles too, which I can post links to if you’d like) I lavished praise on the writing and portrait of Cromwell but criticized her rather stereotypical and very selective portrait of Anne (even from Crowell’s point of view.) She was furious with me, wrote me a blistering letter, and cut off contact completely. I felt she was behaving like a prima Donna who was used to nothing but genuflection. But I felt very sad when she died. He talent was immense.
That’s too bad. I think people will still be reading her trilogy a century from now, it’s that good. But perhaps with that talent and that immersion comes the sin of pride. Also I believe she was in great pain while she was writing much of it so that may also explain her fury.
I have discovered your substack and subscribed as soon as I read this article!
As many did, I loved Natalie Dormer's portrayal of Anne Boleyn, the best part of the show. I was wondering what you thought of Natalie Dormer characterizing Anne Boleyn as a "self made woman". Although the turn of phrase is anachronistic, she was born in ones of the most respected families at the time and she was encouraged in learning languages. I was wondering if by that, Natalie Dormer meant her "devotion" to the Reformation.
You might have already written about it (and I will definitely check), but what did you think of her portrayal in the musical "Six"? Although I found the musical utterly entertaining and moving, she was, as often, portrayed as a vixen which I found quite demoralizing.
Aggh, I just wrote a long reply to you and all of a sudden it disappeared!!! I’ll come back to try to reproduce it later. I’ve got to get ready for an appointment now. Welcome to BordoLines! And make sure to check out the pieces under the “Anne Boleyn Special” tab on the home page.
We visited Hever when I was in England for my book. At the time, I was totally obsessed with Anne (good place to be in when you’re writing a book) and it was magical! By the way, I love your stack. I don’t always have time to read it, but when I do, I love it. Have you seen “October 8”? I’m considering writing about it. We might want to collaborate. In any case, it’s quite terrific. On Prime for rent for $20.
HI Susan, I once worked at a school in Kent and our excursion was to Hever Castle and then I worked in the Primary School right next door opposite the Henry VIII pub. Did you go to Chartwell - Churchill's home - while you were there? It's about 10 minutes away. And Darwin's home is then 10 minutes further along. We don't have American distances in England!
I haven't watched that doc yet. Thanks for the head's up.
Thank-you for the feedback about G&S. Did you like the last one about "The Body" if you managed to read it? It's time to love pain!! I've found that the best way to get over my chronic tension headaches was to simply let the pain happen and enjoy the pain instead of trying to cover it or stop it.
I would very much like to collaborate. Why don't you email me a (dclarkeserret@gmail.com) an article or chapter that you believe would match with G&S?
One question Susan: Please define what you think that Guerre and Shalom is about in 1 pithy sentence. I really need help with this!
I’ll email you. I’m forever struggling with the fact that my stack doesn’t fit into any of substack’s available categories, so I’m familiar with that problem. More later!
I’ve always been fascinated by Anne Boleyn. I think it started with the Six Wives of Henry VIII. Her betrayal by her family and some familiars and trial intrigued me. After watching Anne of the Thousand Days many times at a repertory cinema Genevieve Bujold became a favorite actress. I’m glad you’re interviewing her; she’s my favorite representation of Anne. It’s interesting about Natalie Dormer’s eyes and hair. In fact her eye color (blue, while Anne was famous for her dark eyes) bothered myself and many of my friends. Claire Foy as Anne also had blue eyes. Why directors et al think this isn’t important angers me, because it’s easily contact lens remedied. Mantel’s books are interesting but when I read them I kept wondering why all this energy was focused in Cromwell. (While she definitely was in the Anne:schemer camp) I took lots of British history courses because of Anne. Going to get your book! Thank you so much!
And thank you for your comment!! There’s a whole section in the book about hair, eyes, and beauty. During April and May, I often post about Anne and related Tudor stuff. Hope you’ll subscribe! It’s not the only thing I stack about, but there’s an “Anne Boleyn Special” pulldown tab that has lots of stuff you might find interesting.
Anne is one of the most misunderstood and slandered persons in history. Whether she was manipulated by her father or joined in his ambitions is the questions. Could it have been both? Why wouldn't she want to be queen of England if she could?
My take is that alot of the bad press to come out is thanks to those who wrote history wanting to provide cover for the horrible Henry. They had to defame her, turn her into a depraved whore, in order to make their king have the right to murder her. That so much of that has stuck says more about how society still views strong willed women than anything else.
Now why would they also want to make her blond and blue eyed in the series? Its not like there aren't pictures of Anne everywhere. And this is not Bridgerton or Shandaland, which is a fantastical look at history. This is history. (shakes head)
I have to say I honestly didn't really enjoy the series The Tudors at all, but Natalie's portrayal was grand.
The blonde thing is nuts. But if you look at how Anne has been represented over the centuries, there are lots of blondes in there. One of the ideas in my book is that we’ve represented her according to the standards of OUR times (whatever they have been, historically) rather than hers. By the way, I think you’ll like my book!!
Intriguing article. Makes me want to see it. Been digging into Anne Boleyn as we have an ancestral relative who was Anne's first cousin. Mary Shelton was a beautiful young woman in Anne's court -- and may have been a mistress to Henry. She also was the editor of the Devonshire Manuscript - a book of love poems, which irked Anne. Not sure if any of this came up in the series.
I don’t remember any mention of it in the series. But these pop culture things are always very selective—often to the point of downright distortion (e.g. “The Other Boleyn Girl.” (By the way, if Mary was any relative of Anne then you have something in common with Lisa Chambers, who posted a note above.)
This is so interesting. Lady Anne Shelton is our ancestor. I marvel at the ways in which she kept her actual head.
Yes, quite an accomplishment in those days! Especially for Lady Shelton!
Lisa! Mary Shelton is in my ancestral line. She was the mother of Alison de Heveningham who married Sir Michael de Hardy and was mother of sir John hardy. John’s son Richard came to the states in the late 16th early 17th century.
Whaaaat?!? So I can never quite identify which son is our ancestor in US. I have to look at my tree again, but all roads lead to her. I’ve spoken with a few other folks doing research, but the last time was abt 3 years past so the thread hangs.
I’ve heard lore about her caring for both Elizabeth and Mary, who went on a hunger strike after Isabella forbade her to walk behind Elizabeth to meals as HVIII demanded. Tho she may have been traumatized af with disordered eating. Also how both girls grew up to still have warm regard for her. Badass. I imagine the tension she must have experienced with two teenage girls and literal fkn Bluebeard issuing edicts.
Nice to meet you cousin!!! 💖
It's true that The Tudors went downhill as a series after Anne's execution. Curious to know your take on Hilary Mantel's portrayal of Anne from Cromwell's POV.
You’ve touched on a tender spot. She and I were good “pen-pal” friends (she even gave me an exclusive interview before the second volume of Wolf Hall came out) until I published my book. In it (and in some articles too, which I can post links to if you’d like) I lavished praise on the writing and portrait of Cromwell but criticized her rather stereotypical and very selective portrait of Anne (even from Crowell’s point of view.) She was furious with me, wrote me a blistering letter, and cut off contact completely. I felt she was behaving like a prima Donna who was used to nothing but genuflection. But I felt very sad when she died. He talent was immense.
That’s too bad. I think people will still be reading her trilogy a century from now, it’s that good. But perhaps with that talent and that immersion comes the sin of pride. Also I believe she was in great pain while she was writing much of it so that may also explain her fury.
I have discovered your substack and subscribed as soon as I read this article!
As many did, I loved Natalie Dormer's portrayal of Anne Boleyn, the best part of the show. I was wondering what you thought of Natalie Dormer characterizing Anne Boleyn as a "self made woman". Although the turn of phrase is anachronistic, she was born in ones of the most respected families at the time and she was encouraged in learning languages. I was wondering if by that, Natalie Dormer meant her "devotion" to the Reformation.
You might have already written about it (and I will definitely check), but what did you think of her portrayal in the musical "Six"? Although I found the musical utterly entertaining and moving, she was, as often, portrayed as a vixen which I found quite demoralizing.
Aggh, I just wrote a long reply to you and all of a sudden it disappeared!!! I’ll come back to try to reproduce it later. I’ve got to get ready for an appointment now. Welcome to BordoLines! And make sure to check out the pieces under the “Anne Boleyn Special” tab on the home page.
Thank you, I will!
Fun fact: I used to teach at Hever Primary School.
We visited Hever when I was in England for my book. At the time, I was totally obsessed with Anne (good place to be in when you’re writing a book) and it was magical! By the way, I love your stack. I don’t always have time to read it, but when I do, I love it. Have you seen “October 8”? I’m considering writing about it. We might want to collaborate. In any case, it’s quite terrific. On Prime for rent for $20.
HI Susan, I once worked at a school in Kent and our excursion was to Hever Castle and then I worked in the Primary School right next door opposite the Henry VIII pub. Did you go to Chartwell - Churchill's home - while you were there? It's about 10 minutes away. And Darwin's home is then 10 minutes further along. We don't have American distances in England!
I haven't watched that doc yet. Thanks for the head's up.
Thank-you for the feedback about G&S. Did you like the last one about "The Body" if you managed to read it? It's time to love pain!! I've found that the best way to get over my chronic tension headaches was to simply let the pain happen and enjoy the pain instead of trying to cover it or stop it.
I would very much like to collaborate. Why don't you email me a (dclarkeserret@gmail.com) an article or chapter that you believe would match with G&S?
One question Susan: Please define what you think that Guerre and Shalom is about in 1 pithy sentence. I really need help with this!
I’ll email you. I’m forever struggling with the fact that my stack doesn’t fit into any of substack’s available categories, so I’m familiar with that problem. More later!
I’ve always been fascinated by Anne Boleyn. I think it started with the Six Wives of Henry VIII. Her betrayal by her family and some familiars and trial intrigued me. After watching Anne of the Thousand Days many times at a repertory cinema Genevieve Bujold became a favorite actress. I’m glad you’re interviewing her; she’s my favorite representation of Anne. It’s interesting about Natalie Dormer’s eyes and hair. In fact her eye color (blue, while Anne was famous for her dark eyes) bothered myself and many of my friends. Claire Foy as Anne also had blue eyes. Why directors et al think this isn’t important angers me, because it’s easily contact lens remedied. Mantel’s books are interesting but when I read them I kept wondering why all this energy was focused in Cromwell. (While she definitely was in the Anne:schemer camp) I took lots of British history courses because of Anne. Going to get your book! Thank you so much!
And thank you for your comment!! There’s a whole section in the book about hair, eyes, and beauty. During April and May, I often post about Anne and related Tudor stuff. Hope you’ll subscribe! It’s not the only thing I stack about, but there’s an “Anne Boleyn Special” pulldown tab that has lots of stuff you might find interesting.
Anne is one of the most misunderstood and slandered persons in history. Whether she was manipulated by her father or joined in his ambitions is the questions. Could it have been both? Why wouldn't she want to be queen of England if she could?
My take is that alot of the bad press to come out is thanks to those who wrote history wanting to provide cover for the horrible Henry. They had to defame her, turn her into a depraved whore, in order to make their king have the right to murder her. That so much of that has stuck says more about how society still views strong willed women than anything else.
Now why would they also want to make her blond and blue eyed in the series? Its not like there aren't pictures of Anne everywhere. And this is not Bridgerton or Shandaland, which is a fantastical look at history. This is history. (shakes head)
I have to say I honestly didn't really enjoy the series The Tudors at all, but Natalie's portrayal was grand.
The blonde thing is nuts. But if you look at how Anne has been represented over the centuries, there are lots of blondes in there. One of the ideas in my book is that we’ve represented her according to the standards of OUR times (whatever they have been, historically) rather than hers. By the way, I think you’ll like my book!!
I had already took out your book from Amazon. :)
Intriguing article. Makes me want to see it. Been digging into Anne Boleyn as we have an ancestral relative who was Anne's first cousin. Mary Shelton was a beautiful young woman in Anne's court -- and may have been a mistress to Henry. She also was the editor of the Devonshire Manuscript - a book of love poems, which irked Anne. Not sure if any of this came up in the series.
I don’t remember any mention of it in the series. But these pop culture things are always very selective—often to the point of downright distortion (e.g. “The Other Boleyn Girl.” (By the way, if Mary was any relative of Anne then you have something in common with Lisa Chambers, who posted a note above.)